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SaltySeaWolf

Damage Ratio of Body Damage Compared to Headshot Damage

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I think the armour system is quite Arcade, as a plate in a vest only protects vital organs from direct shots. You are still vulnerable to the side or the ribs, where your heart and lungs are. If a projectile hit a bone in your leg, you would drop like a bag of potatoes.

I would like to see some realism, coming from years of operation flashpoint/ArmA 1/2/3. But I still think the players who enjoy Arcade gun play, like people who come from counter strike etc. should get their piece of the pie.

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Perhaps the compromise is that every time you get hit, it takes you out of ADS, or blurs the ADS?

If you start getting shot, your immediate instinct should be to run for cover.  If you decide to stop and aim, you really shouldn't be able to aim while getting hit with bullets.

Perhaps you could move around a bit and then try to stop and get some shots off, but if you get hit, you should be forced back into movement.

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On 3/31/2017 at 4:36 AM, tom_gore said:

The only thing I would add is some flinching when you get hit. I find it a bit ridiculous that you can keep a steady aim through a 8x scope while getting peppered.

first hit wins the fight? if your 1v1ing somone and they hit you first would u then have a HUGE disadvantage?i think its not bad how they have it now. its slight but not 2 much to where you cant fight back.

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The damage and armour system is a part of the game that probably shouldn't be, or should only be included a certain mode. *cough* Arcade *cough* 

I don't really like the damage system and "loot levels" in general, it ruins the aspect of being capable of taking someone down swiftly with the weapons you find. Unless you manage to tap another in the head 2-3 times without them running off in the process, engaging someone can sometimes be the wrong choice due to differ in weapons, vests and helmets.

I feel no reward when I have a 8x with a SKS and range the weapon for a 600m distance target, falling a little low of the head hitting the chest ON THE FIRST SHOT, then the player takes the damage and runs away instantly. They might not hear the shot direction and take the wrong cover but when you put another down range to the torso and he runs again it really makes you wonder... O.o


I sometimes feel like what is the point in shooting? I won a game by running the last zone against 2 squads... As fun as it is I dislike that I avoid engagements because I know the player could slip behind a rock and begin a wild west shoot out.

It would be cool if limb shots inflicted some serious damage to some effect without them either sprinting off or returning fire immediately. I shot to the chest would be devastating, vests can take way too much. I really hate the rambo side stepping, players running around with 8x just instantly turn to attempt a headshot.

A projectile hitting someone in the flesh or hitting bone is going to cause some serious injury. It would be a different game experience to get maimed from leg, shoulder, arms with a decent animation, to indicate "you are f* up mate!". 
 

I can imagine getting shot, bleeding out, in a bad position, running back to my team only to make it within meters of the get away vehicle to be gunned down like Sgt Elias on Platoon... xD

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I would like to shoot people in the leg and watch them limp or crawl depending whether it was a flesh wound or the bone.

I would like to see a realism mode...

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In 90% of my engagements I'm the one landing the first hit on the enemy because of my superior strategic approach. Still from that 90% of engagements I lose 60% since my aim and reaction is bad and people turn around and just head shot me. I think this game should reward strategic thinking a lot more than plain motoric skill. E.g. shots into someone should throw off their aim, I find that would be also realistic since I can not belive someone can keep aiming perfectly while beeing shot at. This is one of the biggest problems in the game.

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Posted (edited)

In reality there is no helmets that can save a persons head from a bullet, the thought of having people run away after 1  headshots with 5.56mm is beyond ridiculous. 

NERFing the games armor stats actually makes the game more ballanced and realistic. but advanced players will rage against any such NERF until the deveopers change it back.

(Advanced players absolutly hate the thought of losing their aiming advantage to some noob with subpar aiming skills but who is great at sneaking in on them) 

Edited by Sneaky-woodsman
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Hi Guys,

We tried the game with my friend Andy for several hours. At first, we were really won by the game dynamic. And we enjoyed the survivalist approach. running from house to house, taking care of every things, be extremely careful with our displacements and choices. In other words, you have to set up a real strategy to survive a bit, this is great, and you feel it.

And then we encounter our first firefight... and this was disapointing. 

I'll make it short, I read every comments and more on other similar topics, regarding what have been said on this particular topic.
 
I'm 35 year olds, we are experimented players.

In my opinion, dammages are too low to match the game type. You can't ask people to develop a strategy in survival condition, in order to play the last scene with dices. Dammages are not enough realistic to fit a survival horor landscape. 

It's not fair, you should be able to defend yourself with a 9mm pistol because this is survival horor. Behaviour on the field of battle should prevail over aiming skill since guns are tools to survive. 

I mean, what is the point... right now, when it's start shooting, it's just look like some old counterstrike version to us.

Or maybe there's a problem with the damage system, but anyway, it look to us that  player health it's way much too heavy. Or maybe, this game is not what we thinked, then it's not what we are looking for.

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On 29/8/2017 at 8:16 PM, fox.mulder said:

Hi Guys,

We tried the game with my friend Andy for several hours. At first, we were really won by the game dynamic. And we enjoyed the survivalist approach. running from house to house, taking care of every things, be extremely careful with our displacements and choices. In other words, you have to set up a real strategy to survive a bit, this is great, and you feel it.

And then we encounter our first firefight... and this was disapointing. 

I'll make it short, I read every comments and more on other similar topics, regarding what have been said on this particular topic.
 
I'm 35 year olds, we are experimented players.

In my opinion, dammages are too low to match the game type. You can't ask people to develop a strategy in survival condition, in order to play the last scene with dices. Dammages are not enough realistic to fit a survival horor landscape. 

It's not fair, you should be able to defend yourself with a 9mm pistol because this is survival horor. Behaviour on the field of battle should prevail over aiming skill since guns are tools to survive. 

I mean, what is the point... right now, when it's start shooting, it's just look like some old counterstrike version to us.

Or maybe there's a problem with the damage system, but anyway, it look to us that  player health it's way much too heavy. Or maybe, this game is not what we thinked, then it's not what we are looking for.

You are right, this game is set up like a tactical shooter, but with crappy unrealistic call of duty-esque weapon damage.

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3 minutes ago, Mister-Fox said:

You are right, this game is set up like a tactical shooter, but with crappy unrealistic call of duty-esque weapon damage.

It is worse than that, even call of duty has the one headshot 1 kill deal. Players can soak up unbelieable amounts of damage in this game.

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В 31.03.2017 в 15:08, Harry_Whodini сказал:

PLEASE NO! Flinch/Aim punch is an awful mechanic in every game it is in. It gives the person who lands the first shot way too large of an advantage. If I'm hit once in the chest while I'm running towards cover but its kinda far away, then I have no good choice other than to turn and fight or hope that they miss. I have pretty decent aim so I should have a fighting chance here. If I am able to turn and shoot that player in the head quickly, I should have a good chance to either push them into their cover or an opportunity to kill them. I'm already at a severe disadvantage by not having cover to work with, so give me an opportunity to win the fight or force them into their cover.

Aim punch/flinch is a crutch for players that have bad aim. It removes a mechanical skill from players that have good aim because if they get hit once from an ambush, they are almost certainly going to lose the fight and not have a chance to return accurate fire.

I have won a lot of fights because I was the better aimer. Many players have caught me off guard but I was able to turn and take them down before they were able to land shots 3 or 4 or whatever. I have also lost plenty of fights because they caught me off guard but they still had good aim.

TL;DR: Please don't add aim punch. It's a crutch for players with bad aim and favors the person who lands the first shot way too heavily while damage already gives them an advantage.

You must not be able to land a perfect sniper headshot while getting bullets into your chest even with the vest on. It doesn't make sense and is not realistic.

If a person hit you first he should have a lot of advantage. It's realistic. 1) he spotted you first, 2) he hit you first. No aim punch when getting hit is plain stupid.

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First off I have been playing first person shooters since DOOM LOL... I love the premise of this game, when i seen it on steam but after playing a few hundred games im quickly falling out of love. The game has an identity crisis which needs to be sorted out, is it arcade or tactical? It has a tactical survival element with gathering supply's and guns but an arcade damage model? It doesn't make sense at all?  It simply doesn't reward tactical decisions at all and thats terrible! Why stalk and hunt someone when the moment you shoot them they are off like a scalded cat? Long range is useless unless they are in the wide open? It takes four clips and a grenade to kill someone but you can jump and kill someone with one punch?

Quote

PLEASE NO! Flinch/Aim punch is an awful mechanic in every game it is in. It gives the person who lands the first shot way too large of an advantage. If I'm hit once in the chest while I'm running towards cover but its kinda far away, then I have no good choice other than to turn and fight or hope that they miss. I have pretty decent aim so I should have a fighting chance here. If I am able to turn and shoot that player in the head quickly, I should have a good chance to either push them into their cover or an opportunity to kill them. I'm already at a severe disadvantage by not having cover to work with, so give me an opportunity to win the fight or force them into their cover.

Aim punch/flinch is a crutch for players that have bad aim. It removes a mechanical skill from players that have good aim because if they get hit once from an ambush, they are almost certainly going to lose the fight and not have a chance to return accurate fire.

I have won a lot of fights because I was the better aimer. Many players have caught me off guard but I was able to turn and take them down before they were able to land shots 3 or 4 or whatever. I have also lost plenty of fights because they caught me off guard but they still had good aim.

TL;DR: Please don't add aim punch. It's a crutch for players with bad aim and favors the person who lands the first shot way too heavily while damage already gives them an advantage.

 

 

Games i have played like Project Reality and Squad that have this mechanic implemented successfully are almost always more fun and rewarding then a random head snipe while you jump out of a closet like a raging ape IMHO. It rewards tactical decisions and allows for suppressive fire to be used while playing as a squad or duo. 

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1 hour ago, Zoanthid said:

First off I have been playing first person shooters since DOOM LOL... I love the premise of this game, when i seen it on steam but after playing a few hundred games im quickly falling out of love. The game has an identity crisis which needs to be sorted out, is it arcade or tactical? It has a tactical survival element with gathering supply's and guns but an arcade damage model? It doesn't make sense at all?  It simply doesn't reward tactical decisions at all and thats terrible! Why stalk and hunt someone when the moment you shoot them they are off like a scalded cat? Long range is useless unless they are in the wide open? It takes four clips and a grenade to kill someone but you can jump and kill someone with one punch?

 

Games i have played like Project Reality and Squad that have this mechanic implemented successfully are almost always more fun and rewarding then a random head snipe while you jump out of a closet like a raging ape IMHO. It rewards tactical decisions and allows for suppressive fire to be used while playing as a squad or duo. 

Very well said sir! The core problem is described thru these lines. " It simply doesn't reward tactical decisions at all and thats terrible!"

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Yeah and I would made KAR crate-only weapon or make it do just 90-95 damage to the lvl 2 helmet. It is the only non-crate weapon that can 1-shot you with the Lvl 2 Helmet and full health (100+ damage). Even with Lvl 3 Helmet you must have full or almost full HP in order not to be one-shotted (81 damage).

I've done those "skilled" shots a LOT of times. If the opponent is not moving for at least 1 sec, with a 8-scope the headshot is quite easy for any "ok" player.

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I finally have become use to the arcade style to this game. I have grown to enjoy it. Although I would like to see a hardcore mode... I would like to see the dev crew make a mode that is way more unforgiving, but I believe this would require an alternative healing system. The healing system in this game, matches the damage, armour system. Changing one would put the game out of balance.

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Posted (edited)

Hello,

i really think you should increase the damage a player gets, at least when shot in the head (or near) , so it gets a bit more realistic.

You can see in this short video what i mean, how can someone survive that?

 

Edited by rungor

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and another clear headshot (because nothing else than the head is visible) - time to improve damage to make this game more realistic

or at least give us hardcore servers with improved damage -nothing to loose

 

 

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The headshot damage ratio is too high for automatic weapons for sure. As random as this game is, it gets a little out of hand when you're getting a random headshot by spraying and it almost instagibs, no matter which helmet you're wearing. This is not a simulation, it's not supposed to be realistic. Don't increase headshot damage to ridiculous amounts just because you can; it makes no sense for anyone but the simulation fans whose "simulation" is all about getting easier kills by random chance. 

I suggest the developers decrease the headshot multiplier for semi, burst and fully automatic weapons to 1.5, all shotgun headshot multipliers to 1.0, and bolt actions should stay the way they are. Maybe make it that headshots with KAR98 won't oneshot a guy at 100% health and wearing level 2 helmet, because that's just mean.

Also, I feel many guns have too low recoil. By personal experiences I feel the UMP-9,  SCAR, M416, M16, Mini-14 are all unsatisfyingly over-accurate when spraying even over 30-50 meters away. I see most good streamers not putting much effort in it either, so I would say it's not just me. Some only spray even towards targets 100 meters away. Give everything more recoil, ty.

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